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Old 09-16-2013, 09:55 PM   1 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. #1
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Inbee Honor

In a week where we saw controversy on the PGA Tour because a player failed to see his ball move, we had the exact opposite with the Ladies. Inbee saw her ball move very slightly and called a penalty on herself. Congratulations to Inbee! She's shown herself to be a woman of honor and integrity.
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Old 09-17-2013, 03:08 AM   #2
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I didn't know or hear about it, but good for her. Nice to see them doing the right thing.
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Old 09-17-2013, 01:51 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by heddwyn View Post
I didn't know or hear about it, but good for her. Nice to see them doing the right thing.
I read somewhere yesterday that she did this at the Evian.
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:44 PM   #4
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I remember a long time ago, I was following Kathy Whitworth in a tournament when she was playing as a single, and she called a penalty on herself on the putting green. I don't know of any other sport where this happens - the vast majority of professional golfers police themselves. I imagine it's much harder to do that now with so much money at stake, but nearly all of the golfers uphold the integrity of the game.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:47 PM   #5
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The PGA player Charlie was referring to was TIGER.....The ball moved and was caught on video camera clearly doing so. Tiger said the ball was oscillating(a one stroke penalty) and the whole world said it moved and he did not replace it (a two stroke penalty). Tiger lost and was assessed a two stroke penalty.

That same day another PGA golfer was standing over his ball in the rough. Suddenly the golfer stood bolt upright. No one but him could even see the ball in the rough, but he said it moved and he penalized himself one stroke.

Both incidents were shown on the telly.

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Old 09-18-2013, 07:07 PM   #6
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The USGA has an award given for sportsmanship. It's called the Bobby Jones Award.

Why? Because on several occasions, Bobby Jones called penalties on himself which no one saw except him. At least one of those instances cost him a major championship by being penalized a stroke. When he was asked about assessing himself the penalty to the astonishment of some, he said something like "You might as well praise me for not robbing a bank."

It's not just the "vast majority of professional golfers" who police themselves. Every golfer, amateur or professional, should have the integrity to abide by the Rules.

This talk about HDTV and only the top golfers being on video and so on. It's already been addressed by the USGA/R&A. They amended a Rule so that call in views of infractions, only visible on HDTV, would not result in a DQ. But they'd still incur a penalty...and why not? The infraction incurred.
The United States Golf Association and the Royal & Ancient Golf Club, the world's two ruling bodies of golf, have revised a rule that has received a lot of consternation among touring professionals.

Now, players who learn they've committed a violation after signing their scorecards can be penalized without being disqualified. The rule targets television viewers who call in after a penalty has occurred, which has often resulted in the offending player being DQ-ed.

The new interpretation, announced an hour before the first round of the Masters Tournament, goes into effect immediately.

"For some time, we have been concerned that, in certain limited circumstances, disproportionate disqualification penalties have been required by the rules," said R&A chief executive Peter Dawson. "This carefully considered decision reflects our desire to ensure that the Rules of Golf remain fair and relevant in the changing environment in which the game is played today."

Two incidents earlier this year resulted in disqualifications of Padraig Harrington in the European Tour's Abu Dhabi Championship and Camilo Villegas in the PGA Tour's season-opening Hyundai Tournament of Champions in Hawaii.

Harrington was DQ'ed after a slow-motion replay showed that his ball had moved slightly after he replaced his marker. The Irishman knew the rule but didn't realize his ball had budged. Instead of a two-stroke penalty that would have been added to his 65, Harrington was disqualified for signing an incorrect scorecard.

Villegas received the same fate after he was seen by a TV viewer tamping down a divot in a greenside area as his ball - hit short of the putting surface - rolled back toward him. In that case, Villegas still would have been disqualified for not knowing the rule.

Several incidents over the past 30 years have taken place where TV viewers believed they witnessed an infraction. After viewers called the situation in, tour officials reviewed videotape and concurred that an infraction had occurred, resulting in controversial disqualifications over incorrect scorecard signings.

"This is a logical and important step in our re-evaluation of the impact of high-definition video on the game," said newly appointed USGA executive director Mike Davis when the reinterpretation was announced. "We collectively believe that this revised decision addresses many video-related issues never contemplated by the Rules of Golf."
So what do Tiger and Finchem want? If an infraction was clearly visible on t.v. (whether it was Tiger or Joe Blow) it should not be considered to have happened if no one other than a viewer pointed out the violation?

As I recall, the USGA/R&A and the various Tours' positions on looking at viewer or spectator information as to Rules infrations is that they wish to use every means available to maintain the integrity of the Rules.

To those who say the top players are "penalized" by having their every move recorded...yes, they are penalized if they breached a Rule of Golf. Should it be ignored like it never happened?

If I'm going 25 mph over the speed limit in a Red Corvette and get a ticket, is it "fair" that a little old lady behind me in an old silver Buick was also going the same speed but didn't get a ticket?

Was I speeding?...yes. Was she speeding?...yes, but the police officer was not drawn to check her speed. This is not a real good example, because we both were deliberately speeding and breaking the law.

But...You wanna drive a red Corvette (or be #1 in the world of Golf), you need to live with the attention it draws.
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Old 09-18-2013, 09:32 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Charlie View Post
In a week where we saw controversy on the PGA Tour because a player failed to see his ball move, we had the exact opposite with the Ladies. Inbee saw her ball move very slightly and called a penalty on herself. Congratulations to Inbee! She's shown herself to be a woman of honor and integrity.
Wow! I am not mistaken by making Inbee an idol. She's not just good at playing, she also exhibit a true model of her era. Playing with honesty, shows real integrity!
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Old 09-19-2013, 02:40 PM   #8
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I'm not condoning trying to hide a violation, if a Rule is broken it's broken. What I do have a problem with is the way some of these are seen on TV. The violations we are now presented with are seen in ultra slow motion and with substantial zoom, the violation could be indetectable to the human eye at normal distance.

We know Woods ball moved because it was seen in such a close up way, but would a person standing where the cameraman was have seen it in 'normal vision'? It's moot point, but if those particular shots had not been taken and someone had called in that they felt Woods ball had moved but he insisted it had oscillated what would the decision have been?
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Old 09-19-2013, 07:53 PM   #9
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If there had been no video evidence of the ball moving and no testimony from other players or spectators, then the player is given the benefit of the doubt, so he would not have incurred a penalty.

There must be some reasonable evidence that a Rule was breached. It can't be one person saying it happened against the player's opinion that it didn't.

This does happen fairly frequently at all levels of competition, without the benefit of close up cameras and so on. A fellow competitor might report to the Committee a breach of the Rules and might refuse to sign as a marker to a player's card. What does the committee do? It's his word against the player's word. The Committee would investigate the allegation and consider the evidence, including testimony of other players and possibly testimony of spectators. If there is no evidence that a Rules violation occurred other than "he said/he said" , the player is given the benefit of the doubt and no penalty is applied.
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Old 09-20-2013, 08:16 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by LoJo View Post
If there had been no video evidence of the ball moving and no testimony from other players or spectators, then the player is given the benefit of the doubt, so he would not have incurred a penalty.
Okay. So is it equitable that a someone playing with Woods who is going backwards doesn't have every little aspect of his game shown in repeated slow motion and at a high zoom rate, and the 'jury' take his word for it, but Woods is covered regardless?

I'm not defending Woods, or anyone else, just wondering if this is what the USGA/R&A intended when they said they'd accept any information etc. Also, are we going to find players becoming less than honest about calling a penalty on themselves if they know the all intrusive camera will pick up a violation?

I know Americans usually don't understand cricket, but these days there is so much technology as to whether a batsman has hit the ball or not the player is not walking when they know they nicked the ball. Instead they wait on the decision of technolgy, which, to me, is wrong.
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