Navistar Classic Contest

[benchjockey]

Congrats to Elf and thanks to xman for another enjoyable contest.

[ajraymond]

Congrats to Elf and thanks to xman for the contest. Not to cause a problem or seem like I'm ungrateful for the contests I'd like to file a protest on picking the winners of the tournaments. I think if you pick the winner of the contest you should get the full points no matter how many people picked that player. Take this week for example Elf and Loochag pick Lexi and receive -5 points for finishing second but Big Burt receives only -3 for picking the actual winner of the tournament? In fact only -9 was split for the winner of the tournament and -10 was split for the 2nd place finisher. I just think it would be fairer for everyone to award full bonus points for everyone who happens to pick the winner and it also allows everyone who puts their picks in early the same fair chance at bonus points. What's the use of picking a player right out of the gate and having five people pick that same player behind you and you get no bonus even if you win? You might as well pick nobody or wait until the very last second to pick your winner to try and get an advantage. Just a thought.

[xman5]

Originally Posted by Blue

xman,
I calculated my score at 1462, not 1459, through three rounds:

Lewis 204
Tseng 011

H. Kang 205
Thompson 206
Stupples 213

C. Choi 207
V. Hurst 216 (third round 72 from Hee Young Park)

Can you please check?

Your score for Lewis is incorrect.

66 70 65 69

Running Totals
66
136
201 (not 204)
270

[xman5]

Originally Posted by ajraymond

Congrats to Elf and thanks to xman for the contest. Not to cause a problem or seem like I'm ungrateful for the contests I'd like to file a protest on picking the winners of the tournaments. I think if you pick the winner of the contest you should get the full points no matter how many people picked that player. Take this week for example Elf and Loochag pick Lexi and receive -5 points for finishing second but Big Burt receives only -3 for picking the actual winner of the tournament? In fact only -9 was split for the winner of the tournament and -10 was split for the 2nd place finisher. I just think it would be fairer for everyone to award full bonus points for everyone who happens to pick the winner and it also allows everyone who puts their picks in early the same fair chance at bonus points. What's the use of picking a player right out of the gate and having five people pick that same player behind you and you get no bonus even if you win? You might as well pick nobody or wait until the very last second to pick your winner to try and get an advantage. Just a thought.

I understand what you are saying.

The reason why the points are split is because everyone would basically pick Tseng or someone like that who is hot.

The idea is that it is a risk/reward. There is no risk if every one picks the same person that never misses the cut and is usually in the top 10. The points are split to discourage picking the same person as others.

It is also strategy not to pick a winner.

The points are split as nearest whole numbers only. 10/3=3.3333 so it is 3 points for each.


If we did it where all the points were awarded to a correct selection no matter how many selected then we would have to change to risk part of the equation. If your pick does not win then you should be penalized for that, not missing the cut the way it is done now.

The practical matter is what happens below.

Technically the late selectors can dilute you, but they also will then dilute themselves. However as an early selector you are forcing them to make a decision, do they let you get all of the Tseng (or current hot player say Shin if she was entered) points or dilute you, but then diluting themselves or do they take a risk on someone else who is not already selected. This is all an unintended result of the bonus. Of course this is not supposed to happen. We are supposed to be on the honor system where others selections should not influence your selection.

This has been a common complaint and I understand your position.

[Buzzer]

[QUOTE=Blue;134181]I'm sorry to hear about your daughter, grandchild and dog, Buzzer. Life has a way of piling on sometimes.

Thanx, Blue (and 3Putt&Charlie). I've seen it happen to others, but when it happens to you it can be a "why me" situation....and there's just no answer.

[Elf]

Originally Posted by ajraymond

Congrats to Elf and thanks to xman for the contest. Not to cause a problem or seem like I'm ungrateful for the contests I'd like to file a protest on picking the winners of the tournaments. I think if you pick the winner of the contest you should get the full points no matter how many people picked that player. Take this week for example Elf and Loochag pick Lexi and receive -5 points for finishing second but Big Burt receives only -3 for picking the actual winner of the tournament? In fact only -9 was split for the winner of the tournament and -10 was split for the 2nd place finisher. I just think it would be fairer for everyone to award full bonus points for everyone who happens to pick the winner and it also allows everyone who puts their picks in early the same fair chance at bonus points. What's the use of picking a player right out of the gate and having five people pick that same player behind you and you get no bonus even if you win? You might as well pick nobody or wait until the very last second to pick your winner to try and get an advantage. Just a thought.

First: Thanks for congrats ajraymond.
I read your post and xman5 reply. I understand both positions. Just like horse racing betting: it is a risk-reward situation. BigBurt picked the winner and got 3 points. loochag picked second place and got 5 points. Elf picked one of three third place players and got 5 points and won the event. Others picked M. Wie and got a huge 10 point penalty and lost all chances. FAIR?
Hard to say. Many do not think it is and do not participate in this part of the contest. About 30%-40% don't chose a winner. If the reward was higher, would they take a risk and make the event more exciting?

After playing in the contest for so many years and enjoying it; my suggestions would be: a) Stop splitting points when two or more similar selections. b) Give a 7 point award to second place, and continue with 5 points for 3th to 5th and ties. c) Grant 2 points for 6th to 10th and ties.

A lot more points to distribute with the same risk. Hopefully more players would then pick a winner and make the event more exciting. The negative part is more work for the organizer.

This contest has grown from 8-10 contestants to more than twenty. A lot more work for the organizer. So obviously xman5 points of view are determinable.

[Blue]

The split winner's rule went into effect about six years ago when I was running the contest. As xman explained, it was to avoid people taking the easy out and picking the dominant hot player to win.

But also, at the time the contest was set up with this bonus point system, bonus picks were delivered privately to the contest runner (me at the time). So people did not know what other picks had been made and whether or not there would be a potential for splitting points. There was also no disadvantage to entering the contest late in the week.

Not that I think she should go back to this format ... it's enough work for xman as it is.

[xman5]

Originally Posted by Blue

The split winner's rule went into effect about six years ago when I was running the contest. As xman explained, it was to avoid people taking the easy out and picking the dominant hot player to win.

But also, at the time the contest was set up with this bonus point system, bonus picks were delivered privately to the contest runner (me at the time). So people did not know what other picks had been made and whether or not there would be a potential for splitting points. There was also no disadvantage to entering the contest late in the week.

Not that I think she should go back to this format ... it's enough work for xman as it is.

It is evolution that got us to this point. And yes, I tried to avoid the private pick because it seemed to add a lot of work. Also there was a rule to limit the number of times during the season that you could pick an individual player, 3 times I think. Heck it was a no brainer to select Annika or Lorena.

Probably the best idea is a private bonus selection, which I am open too. I would still keep the splitting of the points.

Using the new hot player J Shin as example.
Now you have a decision, do I select Shin and possibly split with others, do I select Shin thinking that others will avoid her and a possible split or select another favorite and risk the same or a total long shot.

We have some time to the next contest.

[dangerbob]

If ain't broke, don't fix it. Just leave it the way it is...no matter what you do, there'll always be a complain.

[I_LOVE_MICHELLE_WIE]

I like it the way it is too. I know I have only played it a few times, but I think it is really fun and makes the tournaments even more fun to follow along with. I wish I had started playing it since I joined this site a few years ago! I look forward to each tournament and playing this game again! Thanks again for all of your hard work in putting this game together for every tournament. I appreciate all of the time, effort, and hard work you must have to put into it every time. Thanks to you, my enjoyment of the tournaments is increased. Even if my favorite player misses the cut, I still have my picks to cheer for! Thanks again for organizing and running such a fun game.