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Old 12-07-2011, 03:57 PM   #21
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The "Q" stands for qualifying, which, in and of itself, shows intent. You may not like the rules, but they're in place. Why should the LPGA, NCAA or any other organization change their rules for one, or a few, players?
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:29 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by gxer View Post
Blue,

I think both you and MP are incorrect about q-school and the NCAA.
--------------------------------
“I wouldn’t turn (pro),” Uihlein said. “I would never do that.”

So why is he going, then? To gain experience and strengthen his resume for when he turns professional after the 2012 NCAA Championship, he said.

Martin: Uihlein to attend Q-School this fall | Golf News at Golfweek

According to the article, Uhlein may also not understand NCAA rules:

"...his presence could still be unprecedented. Both tours require that amateurs who earn cards at Q-School turn pro shortly after the event to accept membership."

As it turned out, turning pro was not an issue that Uhlein had to worry about since he finished well back at the tournament: http://pgatq.bluegolf.com/bluegolf/p.../scorecard.htm

Last edited by Blue; 12-07-2011 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:39 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by MarinePaul View Post
The "Q" stands for qualifying, which, in and of itself, shows intent. You may not like the rules, but they're in place. Why should the LPGA, NCAA or any other organization change their rules for one, or a few, players?
It does not necessarily show immediate intent to turn pro, nor does successfully completing Q-School always require a player to turn pro. It depends on the Tour and its Q-school.

That's the crux of this matter. In previous years when the Futures Tour had a separate Q-School, players could "pass" Q-school and still remain an amateur because the Futures Tour allows amateurs to be members and allows college students to be members. The LPGA does not allow amateurs to be members and after the two Q-Schools were combined this year, the LPGA apparently gave out unclear information on how attendance effected 1) amateur players and/or 2) players wanting to keep their NCAA eligibility.

The LPGA is notorious for giving out wrong information or for not even knowing their own rules. Remember the mix-up at Q-School in 2010 when they didn't know who had even qualified after their own tournament?

Still, as the NCAA is always beating into student-athletes' heads, it is up to them not sponsors or professional leagues and organizations to understand when they might be jeopardizing their eligibility.

In the LPGA's defense, it sounds like they told Kono and her coach only that participation in the final stage of Q-School was necessary to secure membership on the Futures Tour in 2012, not that Kono could stay an amateur after Q-School.

Last edited by Blue; 12-07-2011 at 04:44 PM.
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Old 12-08-2011, 12:20 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Blue View Post
According to the article, Uhlein may also not understand NCAA rules:

"...his presence could still be unprecedented. Both tours require that amateurs who earn cards at Q-School turn pro shortly after the event to accept membership."

As it turned out, turning pro was not an issue that Uhlein had to worry about since he finished well back at the tournament: Second Stage - McKinney, TX - Scorecard for Peter Uihlein
He wasn't going to accept membership even if he earned it, so there was no NCAA problem.
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Old 12-08-2011, 12:25 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Blue View Post
It does not necessarily show immediate intent to turn pro, nor does successfully completing Q-School always require a player to turn pro. It depends on the Tour and its Q-school.

That's the crux of this matter. In previous years when the Futures Tour had a separate Q-School, players could "pass" Q-school and still remain an amateur because the Futures Tour allows amateurs to be members and allows college students to be members. The LPGA does not allow amateurs to be members and after the two Q-Schools were combined this year, the LPGA apparently gave out unclear information on how attendance effected 1) amateur players and/or 2) players wanting to keep their NCAA eligibility.

The LPGA is notorious for giving out wrong information or for not even knowing their own rules. Remember the mix-up at Q-School in 2010 when they didn't know who had even qualified after their own tournament?

Still, as the NCAA is always beating into student-athletes' heads, it is up to them not sponsors or professional leagues and organizations to understand when they might be jeopardizing their eligibility.

In the LPGA's defense, it sounds like they told Kono and her coach only that participation in the final stage of Q-School was necessary to secure membership on the Futures Tour in 2012, not that Kono could stay an amateur after Q-School.
Kono would have stopped after stage II had she not been given incorrect information. She would have deferred Futures tour membership earned at stage II until she graduated next year.
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Old 12-08-2011, 11:49 AM   #26
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As posted by Sag:
"12.1.2  Amateur Status.  An individual loses amateur status and thus shall not be eligible for intercollegiate competition in a particular sport if the individual:
(c) Signs a contract or commitment of any kind to play professional athletics, regardless of its legal enforceability or any consideration received,"

Pure speculation on my part, but I would think that in order to defer membership one must sign some sort of document showing intent. It doesn't seem reasonable to me that one could just say "thanks for the offer, but I'll accept it next year". The LPGA has to reserve a spot for a deferral to protect both themselves and the deferred golfer.
If that is the case then (c) above, comes into play.

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Old 12-08-2011, 01:10 PM   #27
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I don't think that c would come into place, if the defferal is a matter of common practice and I have not signed anything, nor agreed to anything. The outside organization is simply stating that I can join at a later time if I wish.



Also she should not complain. She basically got an extra bonus. She was able to qualify for the LPGA. Not an easy thing to do. Got it locked up. Now she does not have to toil on the Futures tour, making no money, trying to get to the big dance.
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Old 12-08-2011, 01:56 PM   #28
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If the "outside authority is simply stating that you can join at a later time if you wish", then there is no need for a qualifying program.
If something as valuable as a tour card is being offered there should be something in writing or the "outside agency" can simply say we've changed policy...your deferral is no longer viable.
She must have made a "commitment of some kind" for the NCAA to rule as they did. The NCAA is one outfit that vets everything they do very well. (I'm not in agreement with all they do, but they have a very good system and legal department.)
The LPGA or PGA (or any other pro sports organization) are under no obligation to even know, let alone, enforce the rules of the NCAA.

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Old 12-08-2011, 03:49 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Buzzer View Post
If the "outside authority is simply stating that you can join at a later time if you wish", then there is no need for a qualifying program.
If something as valuable as a tour card is being offered there should be something in writing or the "outside agency" can simply say we've changed policy...your deferral is no longer viable.
She must have made a "commitment of some kind" for the NCAA to rule as they did. The NCAA is one outfit that vets everything they do very well. (I'm not in agreement with all they do, but they have a very good system and legal department.)
The LPGA or PGA (or any other pro sports organization) are under no obligation to even know, let alone, enforce the rules of the NCAA.

Viva Annika
Perhaps I have the issue wrong here. I thought the main problem was that she is being told that she must sign now to play on LPGA next year. Signing now would violate NCAA rules so she could not play in the spring college season.


Then there is all the other stuff about what she may have been tolded about what was need just for futures tour, whcih may have been her goal.

But guess what you made the tour, stop complaining, that is the long range goal all along.
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Old 12-08-2011, 04:00 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by xman5 View Post
Perhaps I have the issue wrong here. I thought the main problem was that she is being told that she must sign now to play on LPGA next year. Signing now would violate NCAA rules so she could not play in the spring college season.


Then there is all the other stuff about what she may have been tolded about what was need just for futures tour, whcih may have been her goal.

But guess what you made the tour, stop complaining, that is the long range goal all along.
Here's the full poop on the Kono situation.

The LPGA tour told Stephanie before the last round that she could withdraw and still have full status on the Futures tour and they apologized for their mistake but Stephanie decided to continue anyway.

So, as it turns out, Stephanie can't blame the LPGA tour for causing her financial hardship regarding her college scholarship because she knew the deal and took it.
Kono loves UCLA, but will have to leave it
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